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Old 14-09-2008, 21:06   #1 (permalink)
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i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

i' be really greatfull if anyone would get back to me on this.
wether your apro photographer or only just started.
i'm writing a project for college, its a 2000 word essay which in turn will help me get into uni.
i chose to write this on the development from film to digital and basically which ones better.
in a fewweeks time i'm thinking of developing this into the world of editing, but for now i'm just reasearching the change from film.
so basically, i want to know peoples opinions on which ones better, links to good articals about it people i could write to photographers i could reaserch and anything else you would think of any use?
thanks everyoneeee if you can help meor not!
x
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Old 14-09-2008, 21:22   #2 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Hi Tessa, not wishing to pour cold water on this but I rather get the idea that then other people would be doing your project for you I think you could get a lot of information by searching our site, using your key words. There are plenty of threads which I think could help you and don't forget Google as well

Good luck and post back with specific questions.
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Old 14-09-2008, 22:07   #3 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

i'm asking for "peoples opinions on which ones better"
and "good articals about it"
you've obvosally translated what i asked wrong, go backl, read it again and think about what you just said.
i'v looked on google and other search engiens, i've viewed personal websites for big photographers ... but there is actually nothing of use, nothing i'm looking for, i think the best i found was a quote from Martin about why he now uses digital and honestly i can't write 2000 words on it.
and being a student i find it hard to get many other opinions besidesmy tutors and the other amatre photographers on my course.
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Old 14-09-2008, 22:31   #4 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

My advice for what its worth...you need to think about the pro's and cons of both mediums..film and digital (you'll need to research these if you don't already know) and then discuss those and obviously you will then come to a quantifiable conclusion on which is best.

TBH there are that many sides to this topic that I think I would struggle narrowing the arguments down to a 2000 word essay.
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Old 14-09-2008, 22:57   #5 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Surely it is you who is supposed to be discussing the pros and cons of film vs. digital? The quotes shouldn't be the bulk of an essay like that. You are perfectly capable of weighing up the pros and cons, and then you could find examples of a photographer who still works with film (there are rather a lot still) and one who uses digital, who could be someone from this site, or any other famous photographer working with digital nowadays, like Art Wolfe, and Andy Rouse to name just two nature photographers.

Discuss the specifics of the two mediums; basically what can only be done on one or the other, and then weigh up these lists in a comparison to draw your conclusions. They will obviously include cost effectiveness, weight, size, colour rendition, print size, image quality etc etc.

EDIT: And I'm a student and I've managed to write 1200 words on one photograph, so I don't think you'll have too much trouble if you use some of the advice here

Last edited by JMitchell; 16-09-2008 at 17:30.
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Old 14-09-2008, 23:07   #6 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

ok im not a student but i do live with one and i have to agree with what Jack has said, i "think" its you that should be putting forward the discussion ont he pros and cons, not asking others to discuss it for you. There are plenty places on the web where you will find people waxing lyrical about the beauty of either of these mediums so go have a search.
This next bit of advice is going to be easily taken as an insult, its not meant that way, But unless english is not your native language, I do hope that you will be tidying up your spelling and/ or typing before submitting an essay. I am not the worlds best typer, but then im not the one submitting anything to college.

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Old 15-09-2008, 08:26   #7 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Hi again Tessa, I think Steve and Jack made my point in a better manner.
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Old 16-09-2008, 17:10   #8 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tessa View Post
i'm asking for "peoples opinions on which ones better"
and "good articals about it"
you've obvosally translated what i asked wrong, go backl, read it again and think about what you just said.
i'v looked on google and other search engiens, i've viewed personal websites for big photographers ... but there is actually nothing of use, nothing i'm looking for, i think the best i found was a quote from Martin about why he now uses digital and honestly i can't write 2000 words on it.
and being a student i find it hard to get many other opinions besidesmy tutors and the other amatre photographers on my course.

It all depends on what you are shooting, if it is sport Digital, if it's fine art Film
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Old 16-09-2008, 17:23   #9 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Understand where people are coming from re doing research for ones self, but I think we're being a little harsh on Tessa here. Yes you can go google for others opinions elsewhere on the subject & then form your own opinion, but what better place to ask for part of this information than a photography forum

So come on ya neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee old gits, & help the lass out
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Old 16-09-2008, 17:29   #10 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

I can see your point Dave and I'm sure everyone is happy to give opinions, it's just the good articles and photographer's names etc. that should be done by the student. If the exam board found that out it would be disqualified...
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Old 16-09-2008, 17:42   #11 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

OK, this is my opinion from limited developing & printing with own darkroom vs digital experience to date.

Like most of the older members on here, I started with film as there was no digital option back then. Shooting with an Olympus OM1 I soon got the bug to try my own developing & printing, so invested in a B&W darkroom. There is no better feeling than seeing your 1st print start to appear as you rock your tray of chemicals over the paper That said, at the time all my prints appeared more mid grays , than the blacks & whites I so much craved.

After about 6 months I jacked it all in on following basis :-
- Shooting film could be expensive if you wanted to experiment
- If you only shoot a few shots, you may have to wait weeks before you finish the roll of film, before seeing results
- Darkroom took up a valuable room in the house
- I found I lost track of time in darkroom, often emerging at gone midnight
- I foundit extremely hard to get the results I wanted

Pro's of film though were :-

- Having only 36 shots forced you to take time setting up your shots & getting all your setting correct
- The cameras could be very simple. OM1 was fully manual, so it forced you to understand the technicalities of creating a good shot.
- End prints had a wonderful spread of tones (even if only grays at the time )

SO we move on many years & I dabbled with a Digital Bridge camera. WOW , I could see instant results on my PC !!!! I could take loads of shots & it wasn't costing me a penny. PLus the quality was very impressive !!!. These things got me back in to Photography. Without them, I doubt I would have started again.

With modern Digital cameras & printers, you can be hard pushed to tell which is a Film print vs Digital. The cameras have RAW files that allow you some leeway on your exposure & you can correct that White Balance after the shot. You can now shoot at ridicously high ISO speeds with minimal image quality loss. Image stabilisation gives you an extra 3 stops to play with. Histograms allow you to see your exposure in real time. Let's not even get started with Photoshop & what that can do The list goes on .

Digital has brought so many benefits to the Photographer, yet at the same time caused a few probelms. It's all too easy to let the camera do most of the work for you, to a point where the Photographer does not fully understand the technicalities to make a good shot. In addition you can now shoot 100's of shots on just one card, so we can become lazy in the way we setup a shot. Hey, if one out of a 100 shots comes out, who cares Hey, why do you think Photography courses usually insist on starting back at basics with a film camera

Just my 2p worth.
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Old 16-09-2008, 19:29   #12 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMitchell View Post
EDIT: And I'm a student and I've managed to write 1200 words on one photograph...
Easy if you have a large print and write small.

[cough] I agree 100% or even more with Dave. Digital is almost too easy - people fire off dozens of shots instead of thinking about getting just one right. There's perhaps an excuse with sports photography where you shoot a burst in the hope of getting one or two that are really good, or maybe with some wildlife photography, but otherwise it's better to go for quality rather than quantity.

Some people say they average over 500 shots a week, even when they're not on holiday or anywhere special. So that's about 25,000 a year, or 250,000 in a decade.

Let's say you have some time to look at your old photos, and spend three seconds on each one. That's over 208 hours just to look at them all. If you limit yourself to eight hours a day, you should get through them all in just under a month, with no tea-breaks. By comparison, the old family album was really quite compact.

And don't get me started on auto-this and auto-that. It doesn't matter if your camera has a zillion AF points - only one plane is in true focus. The irony is that many people use just the centre AF point most of the time.

Same goes for exposure metering - Evaluative, Partial, Centre-Weighted, Spot.... sheesh! Sunny day - ISO 100, 1/250 at f/8 and you're done. Well OK it's not always that simple, but however complex the metering system is, you can't have more than one EV per shot.

Teatime now so rant suspended.
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Old 16-09-2008, 20:02   #13 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

So you can see, Digital makes you bitter & twisted
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Old 16-09-2008, 20:07   #14 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

ihave a sumwhat one sided arguement having only used digital, i know what silkstone is saying with quantity as with my slr's i have hudnreds and hundreds of shots but maybe only quarter of them are really what i consider really good anyway by other peoples standards they might be medioca i am just starting to stray away from the auto functions of the cameras.
but the old film photos that i have seen do have that little bit of something it might be a bit more complex need more effort and time but they do turn out really good
cant really say much more just wanted to try n help
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Old 17-09-2008, 19:18   #15 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

I used film cameras for the majority of my life as a working photographer, I changed to digital about 6 years ago, why? Because the field of photography work that I was doing demanded it. No other reason. Newspapers have deadlines and as a freelancer you have to get those pictures out damn fast. I still have my darkroom and some old film cameras and enjoy the whole process of film photography.
With the advent of digital came a whole new group of photographers offering their services as professionals. wedding photographers would do your happy day for £200.00. Hmmm the resulting photographs were probably not worth 200 pence. (just my humble opinion so please dont ask the mods to remove this comment). Digital has made most photographers lives easier, it certainly has mine but I would add that I have had a firm grounding in the basics of photography by working for years with film, and making all the classic mistakes such as too high a shutter speed when using flash.
Financially digital is a large initial investment to make for decent kit but the outlay soon pays for itself. I was not convinced at first that digital would come anywhere near the quality of film and in it's infancy I don't feel that it did, with bigger processors and chips and software coming out all the time I do now feel the gap is closing. I see many photographs on websites and shown me by friends and whilst technically they are very good, they are not good photographs. Digital or film the camera is just a tool, and it is worth remembering that when people boast about how they have a much better camera than yours etc.
Just a few of my musings on the subject, hope it helped in some small way.
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Old 17-09-2008, 19:41   #16 (permalink)
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Re: i'mwriting a project for college and personal oppinions/advise ect needed

Started in B/W film and went downhill from there with cheaper, 'easier' colour and then auto everything. Add the gap between taking and looking at the shot and my pics were dire! Digital allowed instant check and I retain my film roots, shooting 1 or 2 frames and then moving on - but checking that they look OK first if there's any chance of being off.

So, wouldn't disagree with Dave or Gary (especially the point about weddings!) but slightly with Silky!

I guess that technically they're very different: film records the whole scene's colour, digital (or most digital) only record 30-40% of the colours and artificially create the remainder. Seems appropriate that in our increasingly virtual world that cameras should reflect that aspect! Of course, perceptually, both film and digital appear to be pretty much on a par - and perception's what we see...... not reality!
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