Pixalo Photography Community

Go Back   Pixalo Photography Community > Photography Forums > General photography questions and answers

General photography questions and answers: Discuss Poor sharpness...Just a general question. I was out last night along the Thames by Tower Bridge. A place I regularly go ...
Welcome to the Pixalo Photography Community. As a Guest you are free to browse the site, but see what extras you get as a Member here.


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 15-04-2011, 09:09   #1 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Poor sharpness

Just a general question. I was out last night along the Thames by Tower Bridge. A place I regularly go too. Using either my kit 18 - 55 or an 18 - 135 lens I failed to get a single sharp shot. I have used both at the same location and managed crisp images every time on either manual or automatic. My friend had exactly the same results with his Nikon D90. We shot indoors earlier without any issues. It was cold but did not appear misty. Any thoughts?

Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 09:52   #2 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
Markulous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Peak District
Posts: 19,640
Markulous is a jewel in the rough
Markulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the rough

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Pics? Makes it easier to diagnose possible solutions

Possibles:
Out of focus (know you said manual and auto but still a possibility)
Camera shake from slow shutter speed
Very dirty front element/filter!
Smog!
Markulous is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 11:12   #3 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
dabhand16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dunstable Bedfordshire UK
Posts: 30,246
dabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of light
dabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of light

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

How about condensation from going from a warm car to a cold outside temperarure?
dabhand16 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 11:37   #4 (permalink)
AQ
Feet under the table
 
AQ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: West Yorkshire
Posts: 2,031
AQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura aboutAQ has a spectacular aura about

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Camera shake ?? Did you go to the pub before you set out
AQ is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 12:23   #5 (permalink)
Feet under the table
 
bain's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Rotherham
Posts: 1,749
bain will become famous soon enoughbain will become famous soon enoughbain will become famous soon enoughbain will become famous soon enoughbain will become famous soon enoughbain will become famous soon enough

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Quote:
Camera shake ?? Did you go to the pub before you set out
Been There before..... :dizzy

As markulous said we need pics .. did you use a tripod, you could use the mirror lock up to avoid camera shake.or the self timer, shutter speed , though with a tripod this wouldn.t be an issue.
bain is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 14:33   #6 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

I will post an image for your dissection but. I was sober. I did use a tri-pod. I didn't use mirror lock up but I did use live view at times. A Canon 5d mk 2 owner once told me 50 % of Canon pics are out of focus. And he was a Canon owner!!!! That being said my friend had the Nikon D90 with the same issues. By the way it was about 30mins after shooting in a covered market so I don't think condensation was the issue. Maybe I am just having a grey moment lol



Not been shooting for long but last night was a waste. This is one of the pics shot at f11, 1/13, ISO 3200 with a focal length of 57mm. Close up really soft. I have others but you thoughts would be appreciated. For information it was about 8pm last night.

Much appreciated

Last edited by Russell; 15-04-2011 at 14:43. Reason: add pic
Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 16:14   #7 (permalink)
Getting Comfy
 
feeson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: I'm here you fool!
Posts: 156
feeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enough

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Re: Poor sharpness

Hope you dont mind but I had a very quick play with it in PS (anything other than do work at the desk) being honest all it needs is some sharpening applied, tweeked the shadow highlight and you can make out some of the detail on the flags of the weather veins even with the res you posted.
Its a good shot

Last edited by feeson; 15-04-2011 at 16:15. Reason: spelking
feeson is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 15-04-2011, 16:50   #8 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Please feel free to edit any of my images I appreciate the interest and advice. I am going through some tutorials at present specifically about sharpening in Elements 8. Unsharp mask, Adjust sharpness, High pass filter and the like and will try each one in turn to see how they match up. Thank you again. Regards Russell
Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 01:17   #9 (permalink)
Growing roots
 
fionaB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Scotland
Posts: 10,528
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light

Image edit - ASK
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

50% of canon images OOF? he must be a crap photographer then!
fionaB is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 07:53   #10 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

He didn't think so. Wedding photographer presenter at a camera club. That said he had invested a lot of cash and of course trust in his two 5d mk2s. Maybe he was kidding but red rag to a bull to an audience of 50% Canon owners oh and that other brand lol
Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 08:44   #11 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
Whipspeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 3,134
Whipspeed is a jewel in the rough
Whipspeed is a jewel in the roughWhipspeed is a jewel in the rough

No Image editing
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

50% Really, I run a 1D MkIII and a 5D MkII and I would say even with cycling shots 90% are in focus rest or any others are down to user error and the 5D has yet to produce anything soft when I've set it up correctly for a shot, any duff images there are definately user error.
If I had that low a hit rate I'd try another brand.
On your image, do you mean the RAW file is soft straight from camera? I would suggest an adjustment in curves or levels to brighten a little & then sharpen.
__________________
Sarah
http://www.sarahbrookephotography.co.uk
Whipspeed is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 08:48   #12 (permalink)
Getting Comfy
 
feeson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: I'm here you fool!
Posts: 156
feeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enoughfeeson will become famous soon enough

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Re: Poor sharpness

Quote:
Originally Posted by fionaB View Post
50% of canon images OOF? he must be a crap photographer then!
So I'm in the shower this morning and the thought comes to me "what the hell does he mean 50%? He's out his tree" only to find you have beat me too it.

There is no way on earth that 50% of shots from ANY modern DSLR camera is out of focus. Bad workman blaming his tools.
feeson is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 09:07   #13 (permalink)
Growing roots
 
fionaB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Scotland
Posts: 10,528
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light

Image edit - ASK
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Quote:
Originally Posted by feeson View Post
So I'm in the shower this morning and the thought comes to me "what the hell does he mean 50%? He's out his tree" only to find you have beat me too it.

There is no way on earth that 50% of shots from ANY modern DSLR camera is out of focus. Bad workman blaming his tools.
exactly.... and back tot he image, again as has been asked, are you talking about the RAW file being soft? if so it will be. canons raw files ARE definately softer than that "other brand" that however is not the same as being OOF
fionaB is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 10:00   #14 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
dabhand16's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Dunstable Bedfordshire UK
Posts: 30,246
dabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of light
dabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of lightdabhand16 is a glorious beacon of light

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

This photographer - can't remember his name for the moment - has a very unique technique where he not only does formal wedding shots, but also does a lot of snatched candid shots and also gets right into the heart of the action on the dance floor and uses available light for a lot of, if not most of his shots. I think that this is the reason that he made the comment about focus, and it was a more 'off the cuff' remark rather than a measured criticism of Canon. (My my, you Canon folk are VERY touchy today, aren't you ) At the end of the average wedding day he will have taken over 4000 shots, so that should give you an insight as to his technique, which is a cross between fly on the wall and reportage.

He is world renowned in his field and has to limit the commissions he undertakes as the demand for his work is greater than he can cope with. I can assure you that he is not a bad workman.
__________________
Graham
dabhand16 is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 10:00   #15 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Less of my rambling. I have taken a number of shots (at that location - Tower Bridge) using the same camera and same lenses, as has my friend and that night everything we took, hand-held and tri-pod mounted when viewed back in camera was soft / grainy and appeared out of focus. I have looked back a previous images and there is a difference. Maybe mother nature and good old London pollution. Have any of you started out the full of good intentions and it goes down hill from there. As mention maybe I was having a grey moment. Do appreciate your comments as always. Regards

PS I echo Graham's comments above. A humorous comment made during a great presentation.

Last edited by Russell; 16-04-2011 at 10:03. Reason: add words
Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 10:34   #16 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
sejanus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 708
sejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura aboutsejanus has a spectacular aura about
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Quote:
being honest all it needs is some sharpening applied
Feeson has a good point. I've been using Canon dSLRs for six years or so (10D, 5D and 40D) and the default image is very soft next to all my other equipment (Panasonic, Olympus and Sony). There's plenty of detail, though, and a quick run through PS with some unsharp masking brings out the zing, without losing that lovely detail.
sejanus is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 10:57   #17 (permalink)
Growing roots
 
fionaB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Scotland
Posts: 10,528
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light
fionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of lightfionaB is a glorious beacon of light

Image edit - ASK
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Russell are you saying they are soft when viewed in the LCD screen,? cos the images can look completely different on a monitor.
fionaB is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 11:07   #18 (permalink)
Forum Regular
 
Russell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Essex (UK)
Posts: 1,344
Russell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished roadRussell is on a distinguished road

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

I always magnify my images on the LCD to check and review their sharpness and focus as I know you can only rescue a shot so much in PS. Maybe I am obsessing and there was something in the air. For info the view finder thing is ongoing, thanks for the advice and oh my camera's firmware bang up to date as sometimes that can have an effect. Regards
Russell is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 11:10   #19 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
Whipspeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Northamptonshire
Posts: 3,134
Whipspeed is a jewel in the rough
Whipspeed is a jewel in the roughWhipspeed is a jewel in the rough

No Image editing
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Thanks for clarifying that Graham, with that work flow and shooting style, a lower number of keepers is a definate. I thought the original comment was an 'as a rule' comment.
I'm shooting 240 riders this afternoon, so I hope most of them are keepers!
Whipspeed is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Old 16-04-2011, 18:09   #20 (permalink)
Pixalo Crew
 
Markulous's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Peak District
Posts: 19,640
Markulous is a jewel in the rough
Markulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the roughMarkulous is a jewel in the rough

Image editing O.K.
User's Gallery
Users Camera Equipment List
Re: Poor sharpness

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabhand16 View Post
How about condensation from going from a warm car to a cold outside temperarure?
Pretty sure it's the other way around? Cold water taps and stem in bathroom -> condensation

Don't find the image particularly soft but I guess you could contribute some to the lens, some to the conditions (not especially contrast enhancing conditions with the somewhat flat lighting), some to lack of sharpening (somewhat 'black arts' in nature as there's really no one solutuion to fit all scenarios) and maybe a little to the lack of mirror lockup (bit of an unknown as it's most effective at around the 1/60 down to 1/2 sec - maximal at about 1/30)

For you both to suffer from the lack of sharpness I'd suggest the conditions as greatest contributor

With respect to the Canon and 50% in focus, I'd be surprised at the high figure but unsurprised that it's a significant figure. I've the 7D which is said to be "fast" and "accurate" with focussing but do find my keepers nothing like 100% (this just looking at focus in isolation - not comp) even under ideal lighting conditions - but this is shooting fast moving dogs which can accelerate/decelerate and appear/disappear at an astonishing rate, so going to really test any focus system.

Ironically the latency found in my 70-200 f/2.8 can be improved by using the 150-500 which focusses slower but it's lower sensitivity can be an advantage as you don't really get under/overruns on focus. This is obviously not a problem with relatively long tracking with a consistent speed where you can achieve a smooth camera movement
__________________
~CanonCreativity + SigmaSurReality~
ΜΛЯΚ @ Photobucket
Markulous is offline  
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sharpness. simpbow General photography questions and answers 8 06-11-2009 21:19
Lens sharpness MikeSwanwick Cameras, Lenses and Accessories 3 05-08-2008 15:05
Overcoming my sharpness issues... the_frog Photos for fun 4 13-07-2008 07:23
In poor taste slocookn Photo Critique 6 10-04-2007 20:44
Poor Lad!!! Angus Jokes and Funny Threads 10 13-02-2007 08:52


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:51.


vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
ReviewPost & PhotoPost vB3 Enhanced, Copyright 2003-2014 All Enthusiast, Inc.
SEO by vBSEO 3.3.0
Copyright © 2006 - 2017 Pixalo.com

1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196