Question for dod. (or anyone)

busterboy · 18-02-2006, 16:39

Still struggling to find the ultra macro shots you are acheaving mate.

I have taken around 50 macro shots today with this being one of the best.

Camera on monopod.
Focal length 150mm
Exposure 1/40th
F.18
ISO: 500

Any tips other than using the tripod which can be a pain with macro..

mrgubby · 18-02-2006, 16:43

Tripod is a must . DOF at f1.8 is tiny so any movement causes problems.

busterboy · 18-02-2006, 16:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrgubby

Tripod is a must . DOF at f1.8 is tiny so any movement causes problems.

Yes but my shot is F.18 not f.1.8..

mrgubby · 18-02-2006, 17:00

oops , must read post properly

Focal length is 150 mm ?? then you need shutter speed of 1/150 ish , 1/40th will blur it .

You need a tripod

busterboy · 18-02-2006, 17:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrgubby

You need a tripod

I have a very nice tripod and must use it..

The monopod is much easier and quicker, Although here I am asking questions like this...

Thanks for the tips mrgubby..

***Steve*** · 18-02-2006, 17:55

Getting sharp results has as much to do with shutter speed/focal length as it does actually having correct focus. Having focus lock and then using a shutter speed that is going to introduce shake will result in a blurred photograph every time.

As you have already said, use your tripod or ensure that your shutter speed in at least at the same as your focal length. If you have to underexpose as well to keep shutter speeds up and then correct the image during processing.

Even when you get all of the above spot on macro work is still very demanding and will often drive you nuts when your results are less satisfactory than you hoped. The only solution is to keep at it, work at getting the right technique and the correct setting and trust the rest to luck.

On saying all that, the above shot is nothing to be disappointed with

CT · 18-02-2006, 18:07

Not a bad shot Tim, but why aren't you using that fancy new macro flash you've bought?

It's the only way you're going to get small apertures and a fast enough shutter speed.

If the macro flash has high speed flash capability you can use any shutter speed right up to 1/8000th sec.

busterboy · 18-02-2006, 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by CT

Not a bad shot Tim, but why aren't you using that fancy new macro flash you've bought?

Well the sun was beaming down making me think no extra lighting was needed..

Quote:

Originally Posted by CT

It's the only way you're going to get small apertures and a fast enough shutter speed.

If the macro flash has high speed flash capability you can use any shutter speed right up to 1/8000th sec.

There's another lesson learnt today Cedric. Thank you..

dod · 18-02-2006, 18:15

WHat CT said really. It looks like you have used flash but at 1/40th it's a real struggle. I'm usually looking for at least 1/250th with the 100mm, more if I can get it.

I agree about the tripod, a right PITA with macro. Goes against common wisdom maybe but by the time your set up the subjects usually gone

Edit: ah, the shadows sun, not flash

**stepheno** · 18-02-2006, 19:48

Thanks for the thread BB - I learnt something from it

regards

Fangman · 18-02-2006, 19:59

I try to learn something every day from you lot - the trouble is at my age I forget two. Shutter speed should match TRUE focal length so I am told - but with a smaller sensor in the 350D do we have to multiply by 1.6 or something.
I suppose the next thing built into the info sreen will be a calculator to confuse the old chap.

CT · 18-02-2006, 20:13

To engage Hi Speed Sync set the flash on TTL then select Hi Speed Sync which puts up a lttle flash symbol right next to 'TTL' with a letter 'H' by the side of it - on the 580 EX anyway. In the camera viewfinder (20D) you now get a letter 'H' at the left bottom of the viewfinder alongside the flash 'ready' symbol to confirm you're using Hi Speed Sync. Curiously, you don't get the viewfinder confirmation with the 1DMK2, although it still works fine.

My approach is to use TV Mode and set the shutter speed I want to use - say 1/500 at f8, letting the flash match it's output to those settings. remember it's not true sync - the flash actually strobes to keep the whole frame illuminated as that moving slit between the two shutter curtains travels across the sensor. With very fast shutter speeds and very small apertures, there obviously comes a point where the flash will struggle to provide adequate illumination, so then you just use a longer shutter speed or larger aperture, although you always have the option of increasing ISO.

Even using this fantastic technique you'll still get a gazillion crap macro shots if you're hand holding but your hit rate should improve dramatically.

CT · 18-02-2006, 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fangman

Shutter speed should match TRUE focal length so I am told - but with a smaller sensor in the 350D do we have to multiply by 1.6 or something.

No. It's till the same focal length lens, it's just the field of view which is affected by the 1.6X factor.

I know... it makes your 'ead hurt

wez130 · 19-02-2006, 00:48

i'd suggest not using the macro flash (which i wish i had*), because you're using the 180mm macro lens, chances are you wil be some distance away from your subject, which your macro flash will be quite useless afaik, what i'd suggest is a normal flash which is more powerful in the sense it works greater distance than a ring flash.

* the reason iwish i had a macro ring flash is coz i cheat when it comes to macro. i use my 35-80mm lens reversed and get fantastic results, i'd say at least as good as a dedicated macro lens, however, i need to focus within an inch of my subject such that my flash is useless without being bounced, however, i have had some great results

CT · 19-02-2006, 11:28

A macro ring flash is well capable of outputting flash for longer macro lenses Wez, but Tim has actually invested in this brute....

If he doesn't use it soon though, a Canon snatch squad should come and take it off him.

and give it me

dod · 19-02-2006, 11:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by CT

and give it me

Get to the back of a disorderly queue

busterboy · 19-02-2006, 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by CT

A macro ring flash is well capable of outputting flash for longer macro lenses Wez, but Tim has actually invested in this brute....

If he doesn't use it soon though, a Canon snatch squad should come and take it off him.

and give it me

The way I am framing with it this morning its first come first serve..

18-02-2006, 16:39	#1 (permalink)
busterboy Been here a while Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Harrogate. Yorkshire Posts: 496	Question for dod. (or anyone) Still struggling to find the ultra macro shots you are acheaving mate. I have taken around 50 macro shots today with this being one of the best. Camera on monopod. Focal length 150mm Exposure 1/40th F.18 ISO: 500 Any tips other than using the tripod which can be a pain with macro..

18-02-2006, 17:55	#6 (permalink)
*Steve* Pixalo Crew Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: An Englishman living in Germany Posts: 16,374	Getting sharp results has as much to do with shutter speed/focal length as it does actually having correct focus. Having focus lock and then using a shutter speed that is going to introduce shake will result in a blurred photograph every time. As you have already said, use your tripod or ensure that your shutter speed in at least at the same as your focal length. If you have to underexpose as well to keep shutter speeds up and then correct the image during processing. Even when you get all of the above spot on macro work is still very demanding and will often drive you nuts when your results are less satisfactory than you hoped. The only solution is to keep at it, work at getting the right technique and the correct setting and trust the rest to luck. On saying all that, the above shot is nothing to be disappointed with __________________ .......__o .......\<, ....( )/ ( )

18-02-2006, 20:13	#12 (permalink)
CT Feet under the table Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Mids UK Posts: 3,500	To engage Hi Speed Sync set the flash on TTL then select Hi Speed Sync which puts up a lttle flash symbol right next to 'TTL' with a letter 'H' by the side of it - on the 580 EX anyway. In the camera viewfinder (20D) you now get a letter 'H' at the left bottom of the viewfinder alongside the flash 'ready' symbol to confirm you're using Hi Speed Sync. Curiously, you don't get the viewfinder confirmation with the 1DMK2, although it still works fine. My approach is to use TV Mode and set the shutter speed I want to use - say 1/500 at f8, letting the flash match it's output to those settings. remember it's not true sync - the flash actually strobes to keep the whole frame illuminated as that moving slit between the two shutter curtains travels across the sensor. With very fast shutter speeds and very small apertures, there obviously comes a point where the flash will struggle to provide adequate illumination, so then you just use a longer shutter speed or larger aperture, although you always have the option of increasing ISO. Even using this fantastic technique you'll still get a gazillion crap macro shots if you're hand holding but your hit rate should improve dramatically. __________________ Canon 1DMk2N/ EF 50mm 1.4/ EF 17-40L/ EF180L Macro/ EF100-400L Canon 20D /17-85 EF-S 580EX Flashgun/ Gitzo Explorer

18-02-2006, 16:43	#2 (permalink)
mrgubby Been here a while Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Hertfordshire Posts: 328	Tripod is a must . DOF at f1.8 is tiny so any movement causes problems.

18-02-2006, 17:00	#4 (permalink)
mrgubby Been here a while Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Hertfordshire Posts: 328	oops , must read post properly Focal length is 150 mm ?? then you need shutter speed of 1/150 ish , 1/40th will blur it . You need a tripod

18-02-2006, 18:07	#7 (permalink)
CT Feet under the table Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Mids UK Posts: 3,500	Not a bad shot Tim, but why aren't you using that fancy new macro flash you've bought? It's the only way you're going to get small apertures and a fast enough shutter speed. If the macro flash has high speed flash capability you can use any shutter speed right up to 1/8000th sec.

18-02-2006, 18:15	#9 (permalink)
dod Feet under the table Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Nairn Posts: 1,911	WHat CT said really. It looks like you have used flash but at 1/40th it's a real struggle. I'm usually looking for at least 1/250th with the 100mm, more if I can get it. I agree about the tripod, a right PITA with macro. Goes against common wisdom maybe but by the time your set up the subjects usually gone Edit: ah, the shadows sun, not flash

18-02-2006, 19:48	#10 (permalink)
stepheno Pixalo Crew Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 6,800	Thanks for the thread BB - I learnt something from it regards

18-02-2006, 19:59	#11 (permalink)
Fangman Forum Regular Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Ely Posts: 1,090	I try to learn something every day from you lot - the trouble is at my age I forget two. Shutter speed should match TRUE focal length so I am told - but with a smaller sensor in the 350D do we have to multiply by 1.6 or something. I suppose the next thing built into the info sreen will be a calculator to confuse the old chap.

19-02-2006, 00:48	#14 (permalink)
wez130 Getting Comfy Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 136	i'd suggest not using the macro flash (which i wish i had), because you're using the 180mm macro lens, chances are you wil be some distance away from your subject, which your macro flash will be quite useless afaik, what i'd suggest is a normal flash which is more powerful in the sense it works greater distance than a ring flash. the reason iwish i had a macro ring flash is coz i cheat when it comes to macro. i use my 35-80mm lens reversed and get fantastic results, i'd say at least as good as a dedicated macro lens, however, i need to focus within an inch of my subject such that my flash is useless without being bounced, however, i have had some great results

19-02-2006, 11:28	#15 (permalink)
CT Feet under the table Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: West Mids UK Posts: 3,500	A macro ring flash is well capable of outputting flash for longer macro lenses Wez, but Tim has actually invested in this brute.... If he doesn't use it soon though, a Canon snatch squad should come and take it off him. and give it me