[Les Meehan]

Shot this today, beautifully tranquill place.

[Charlotte]

That's lovely, Les, + certainly looks tranquil

[Rob Barron]

It looks a bit flat but I guess that is just how it is there as it is clearly old and it hasn't get any direct lighting on it to enrich it. It's a pleasant record of what is there though. I bet that place has a lot more great pics to be had.

Cheers,
Rob

[Les Meehan]

Rob

This is how the image came into ARC...

I did the usual tonal adjustments but in addition I reduced the saturation to obtain the final muted colours (I haven't done a screen grab for this).
In PS I used the Distort tool as shown here to correct verticals...

The problem with this is the distortion introduced by the wide lens which the distort tool hasn't fixed. This is apprent in the red ringed areas of the column. These bits make it obvious that the perspective is off. To correct these I used Lasso to create a feathered selection of each part and copied it to a new layer. I then used the Distort tool on each new layer to adjust the problems and added a layer mask to allow me to blend them back into the image. The final layers palette is like this...

Obviously other adjustments were needed such as using the Polygon selection around that large picture to create a masked levels adjustment layer to brighten it up.

I know this is all normal for you but others may find the info useful/interesting.

You made the point that the image didn't seem to be heavily processed (hate that expression BTW) which is rather a compliment because in my opinion good manipulation shouldn't be apparent to the viewer (thank God the days of badly burnt-in skies on mono prints is over!).

Regards

Les

[Rob Barron]

Originally Posted by Les Meehan

Rob....

You made the point that the image didn't seem to be heavily processed (hate that expression BTW) which is rather a compliment because in my opinion good manipulation shouldn't be apparent to the viewer (thank God the days of badly burnt-in skies on mono prints is over!).

Oh Les, if only that last sentence were true! Sadly on my circuit tour as a judge of photographic competitions, I see badly done manipulation all the time. The really good stuff is stuff that I look at and because I have a fair bit of PS experience i know they have changed things but it doesn't matter in the slightest because it has been done very well and makes a real improvement to the image. But the number of pictures i see that are so obviously done because they are badly thought out and badly carried out are numerous and sadly I still get the odd one who comes up and tries to insist that they haven't done anything to it. I usually suggest they put their lenses in for a much needed servicing if they are giving such bad haloes around images and add 'I must say though that it is interesting your lens is only adding the halo along the skyline yet everywhere else it doesn't!'

Still, people are learning and that is the most important thing. I just wish a minority of people would show a bit more integrity in admitting they are trying things out, getting used to the new tools and developing their skills (all laudable) rather than trying to kid people that they are only showing what they achieved in camera. making adjustments is FINE, I have said a thousand times that we are still doing what we did in the darkroom, albeit using different tools and, once learnt, with a lot less heartache and wasted materials than we often had to suffer. I am only interested in the image as it stands. The question is, does it work or doesn't it?

Your work is clearly excellent and seeing the screenshots to show how you achieved things is very good of you and extremely helpful to people who are perhaps still struggling with the steep early learning curve that PS certainly has. And let's be honest, no matter how much experience we have, there is always something new to learn. I have picked up loads of ideas from other people on Pixalo for which i am very grateful. Seeing how others do it often makes me re-evaluate how I do it and if their way is easier I am not too proud to dump my method for theirs LOL.

Thanks again, much appreciated.
cheers,
Rob

[Les Meehan]

Rob

I agree with everything you have said! Having been seriously involved with photography since making a pinhole camera out of a shoe box in a physics class when I was 11 yrs old, I have 'done the rounds' so to speak.

After becoming brassed off with 'club land', like you was on the judging circuit (in NW), I decided to give up a promising career as a computer programmer (in those days we wrote the code with a pencil on prepared forms), what a BIG mistake could have made millions inventing Windows before Gates, I returned to college full-time at Blackpool to study professional photography (late 1970's). That was a real eye-opener! I've been a pro ever since. My early experience as a programmer meant I was always at the front of the digital imaging learning curve (never at the top of that curve alas).

In my opinion there are simply no 'real experts' in digital imaging because the goal posts change so fast it is impossible for one person to be an 'expert' (expert today, beginner again tomorrow, well almost). What one can become, and I think I fit this bracket as you probably do also, is very experienced and set yourself very high standards.

In many ways, having spent sooo many years learning and refining my traditional photo skills, both practical and perceptual, I find digital rather depressing in that you never really feel you have a handle on the thing. OK, I've written seven books on the subject (six actually, my first was 'the' book on exposure control that everyone should read!) but I still feel like a beginner. I know this isn't really so but when a new version of xyz comes out my heart sinks at the thought of that learning curve needing to be climbed 'yet again'.

Don't get me wrong, I really believe that digital imaging and manipulation are the bee's knees and love doing it. But coming from the traditional side, where I knew/know I am an expert (I wish we still used the guild system of Master Photographer, love the sound of that) one can't help get the feeling that real digital expertise is always 'just out of reach'.

Anyway, all we so called experts can do is help others climb the learning curve and keep learning ourselves. As a qualified teacher, as I understand you are too, we know that learning is a two-way process (Teacher/Student and Student/Teacher) and only the arrogance of many people keeps them from believing that and hence gaining from that two-way experience.

Oop's seem to have gone on rather, sorry about that, enjoyed the chat.

Regards

Les

[Rob Barron]

We are much more of a like mind than I previously thought I must confess. I would never consider myself an expert as that would set me up for a huge fall but I do try and keep on learning so that I am hopefully progressing. I love learning, it is a passion of mine and so I guess it was natural that i would also end up as a teacher.

Actually, if anything, teaching is what I do best. It is not because I know lots of stuff other people don't know, I just have (I think anyway) a reasonable gift for communicating and what I don't know I usually know where to look to find the answer and then try and communicate that as best I can.

I actually love the fact that I never feel I can quite master digital imagery as I love the idea that if I keep on 'playing' another surprise is just round the corner. I try to keep track of what I do so that I can repeat the steps in the future. I guess when CS3 comes out I am going to be back to that huge learning curve again as I get to grips with the new tools available to us. But hey, that just means the world becomes a more exciting place.... hopefully.

The reason I am passionate about Pixalo is that I see all levels of enthusiasts getting involved, enjoying the boards and giving and taking as required. Sometimes I give, when I can, but frequently I am the student.... learning as much as I can and slapping my forehead every time I reaslise something that has hitherto eluded me! The people on hgere are great, I have got to know quite a few through continual messages back and forth on threads, and I know several whose opinions I have come to highly respect and when they speak, I listen. Not saying I don't listen to everyone, obviously I seek to learn something wherever and whenever possible, but some have earnt a great deal of respect for their insights into this wonderful craft and I have gained a wider gamut of knowledge and experience through their pearls of wisdom

I really must get hold of this Exposure Control book anbd have a good read. It sounds most interesting.

Cheers,
Rob

[Les Meehan]

Rob

We are much more of a like mind than I previously thought I must confess.

That sentence made me smile because I was aware (possibly mistakenly) that the first few posts I made on threads you were posting to seemed to generate a "who's this new kid on the block, better sus him out" type of response from you (vis a vis, asking for ISBN's for my books, to prove I was genuine or a vanity published egotist??). It is always the norm that men tend to challenge each other in the first instances, its genetic, until they either reach a situation of disliking each other or sharing a mutual respect and becoming friends. The latter is always my purpose but sometimes, as is normal for everyone, it isn't possible and in such cases I tend to not waste time on such people.

By communicating on this thread I like to think you and I have reached the mutual respect stage and are on our way to being friends (even if only virtual ones).

I agree with what you say about Pixalo, it does appear to be populated by mature, reasonable people (mature in attitude not necessarily in age) with a desire to share with and learn from each other.

If you were a girl I'd give you a bug hug but as you're a bloke here's a respecting handshake (OK its a wave then). Oh sod it, have the hug as well

Here's to sharing, caring and generally being nice to people!

BTW, my exposure book is for beginners to intermediate so I doubt if there would be much for you in it. It is a very practical, down to earth approach to doing the job and not a heavy technical book. Having said that it is used in at least one photography college in Australia as their preferred text for newbies and is sold at MOMA in the USA. Just wish it brought some money in!

Regards

Les

[Sonsey]

Don't you just love to see a good bit of male bonding... now let's all do as we men do, and drink some beer

[Les Meehan]

Make mine a pint of Murphy's

[Rob Barron]

ROFL, that posting just HAD to bring a smile to my face

Whilst we do tend to 'see what each other is made of' at times, just want to mention that I was genuine in asking for the ISBN number as I genuinely wanted to buy the book

But yes, we do know where each other is coming from now and I certainly respect your ability to come up with some excellent shots, no question at all

Only problem is, I hate beer LOL!

Cheers,
Rob

[mouldy101]

aaaahhhh..... I'm welling up!!!

[Angela]

Group hug! Group hug!